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Topics - Schoen-hopper

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General Banter / Visit to KC 5/28,29
« on: May 26, 2011, 03:34:49 PM »
Looks like I may finally get to play Young Park this Saturday, 5/28, likely late morning.  Looks like an amazing course from the pics on DGCR.  Can't get the map to print full size there.  If there is time, might stop at Yates before or after.

Then WW on Sunday morning, maybe a Down Under Round afterwards or check out Old Pike if there is time.

Going to play some "ball golf" too.  The KC area has TONS of courses.   Some that caught my eye: Dub's Dread, Painted Hills, Sycamore Ridge, Iron Horse, Swope, Shoal Creek, Hodge Park, Tiffany Greens.  Thinking of doing Shoal Creek on Saturday pm and Iron Horse on Sunday pm.  Swope and Dubs Dread look to be close runners up.  Any recommendations?

General Banter / Fantasy Disc Golf League
« on: February 19, 2011, 03:17:31 PM »
Check out this new site:

Chris Smith and I purchased a league, good for up to 100 players.  Looks like fun!  Should be free to join; I welcome you to do so.  The league name is KDGA.  You will need the invitation code, which is EIS2VVE3.  Make sure to create an account, join the league, and make your picks before March 2nd, which is the beginning of the Memorial, the first of 5 events on the first tour.
Here is a thread on the KDGA site to follow the action.

Tournaments / 21st Annual Doo Dah, June 5th & 6th
« on: May 16, 2010, 03:34:41 PM »
21st Annual Doo Dah Open
June 5 & 6, 2010
Herman Hill & Oak Parks in Wichita, Kansas

A PDGA "B" tier event on the KDGA tour
100% minimum payback required for all divisions
First 100 registered players to receive a “special” players pack

ALL DIVISIONS OFFERED (Must have at least 3 participants in the division):
(Prize fund & fees) Open $70; Masters $65; Grandmasters $65; Open Women $70
Advanced $45; Advanced Masters $45; Advanced Grandmasters $45; Advanced Women $40
Intermediate $30; Intermediate Women $30; Recreational $25; Juniors $20
Ace fund $5—non-PDGA members pay an additional $10 fee

: Pre-register by mail or
online @
Friday June 5th - 6:00 pm to 8:30 pm
Saturday June 6th - 8:30 am to 9:30 am
Players meeting: Saturday June 6th - 9:40 am
1st round tee off: Saturday June 6th - 10:00 am
(Meet at the WATER Center in Herman Hill Park)

Come experience two of the top courses in Kansas.
Pre-registrations encouraged. Field will be limited to the 1st 144 registered players.

Please pre-register on-line or mail your pre-registration to the
Air Capital Disc Golf Club, Inc., c/o Iqbal Jehan,
1660 Foliage Dr. Wichita, KS 67206 (

General Banter / What's going on in KC this weekend?
« on: May 23, 2009, 01:36:10 AM »
Actually got a weekend off work.  Might cruise up to KC and enjoy some great courses and whatever else is happening.

How's the Lee's Summit course playing?  Had a few days with no rain?  Blue Valley mowed?  WW sounds ripe for the playin'.

Still don't know what I'm up to.  Hope to check back.  316 250-1967.

General Banter / KDGA 2009
« on: February 22, 2009, 10:38:57 PM »
Kan U Wyco is going to be a KDGA "supertour" event.  Or in the top 15 tourneys and earning double points for KDGA members.

The Kansas Disc Golf Association is now in it's 21st year.  The Oz Tour now includes 40-some events throughout Kansas!  130 member record the last couple of years.

KDGA membership is 25 bucks and includes a shirt, disc, bag tag, free BBQ at the KS state championship tournament in Beloit, free Banquet dinner at the awards ceremony after the final tournament, and a points system that functions for end of year awards and a qualification system for a free "finals" tournament at the end of the year with a payout averaging $50 per player.

For players planning on attending a few tournaments in Kansas this year, the KDGA is a fun organization to be a part of.  If you are considering joining, but not now, remember that you can still get your points for prior KDGA tournaments if you sign up before Beloit (in July).  Visit for more info.

Found and Lost / Lost Ch. Spider & Ch. Wraith at Water Works
« on: January 01, 2009, 02:04:57 PM »
I lost the green Wraith on hole 1 probably buried at the bottom left of the long placement under the leaves.
I think I somehow left the white Spider on hole 8 and it was already picked up when I went back to look for it.

General Banter / Need TJ Ring's Phone Number
« on: December 28, 2008, 06:51:01 PM »
The number I have for TJ automatically hangs up after 4 rings.  Never encountered that before.

Can someone private message or call me with his new number or Steve Slinker's number?  I was going to hit him up for a round of golf.  Will be in KC tomorrow and Tues.

My number is (316) 250-1967.

Tournaments / Wichita Round Up, 11/1/08
« on: October 24, 2008, 03:10:42 PM »
2008 Wichita Round Up
disc golf tournament

Herman Hill 18 hole course
by the Air Capital Disc Golf Club

Saturday, November 1, 2008
PDGA C-Tier Event
KDGA Event

starts at 8:30am (approximately) & ends at 9:40am
Players meeting at 9:45am with a 10:00am tee off (don't be late)

Meet at the WATER Center building

1 round from blue tees, 1 round from red tees
Short pins all different from those used at Doo Dah

The following divisions will be offered if at least 3 players show up for the division:
COST (Prize fund & KDGA fees):
Please NOTE: all PDGA members will receive a $10.00 discount to play in this sanctioned tournament:
Open Men $45 Open Women $30
Masters $45 Am Women $30
Advanced Men $35
Am Masters $35 Intermediate Men $30
Novice $25 Juniors $15

Ace fund $ 5 (ACDGC members get 50% of the club fund in addition to the tournament pot.)

Tournaments / The Rock
« on: June 26, 2008, 11:07:59 AM »
I don't know what is going on in KC this weekend, but there is a great tourney going down in Salina.

Indian Rock Park makes for a fantastic disc golf course layout.  They only do this once a year.  Features a  couple shots throwing off a cliff, including one with a cool island green.

Come check it out.  One of the KDGA's best tourneys.  Word is they have a lot of sponsorship this year.

WYCO / Wyco League, April 11th
« on: April 11, 2008, 12:15:42 AM »
Hoping to leave work early and make it up in time for league.  Got a 3 hour drive, so it'll be close.  Dependent on a few other factors as well.  I'll post back at mid-day.

General Banter / Trip to KC to play some new courses!
« on: March 29, 2008, 09:21:14 AM »

I'm hoping I can come up in two weeks on Redbud weekend.  I want to play the tourney Sat. and check out some new courses in the area on Sun.  I was wondering if anyone could help me out with directions.  I don't see but one of these courses on the PDGA course directory.

*Shawnee Mission: Shawnee Mission Park (I can probably find that one).

*Independence: William Yates Sprint DGC (this one is in the directory).

*Leavenworth: Saint Mary's.  Think I could get out there for a round, Kevin?  I'll post back soon once I'm more certain I'm coming.

*Pleasant Hill: ?  Where can I find info on this course, directions.  Maybe a map link.

*Lee's Summit: ?  No buckets on this course yet, is that right?

With all these new courses, it will be tough to get that round in at Water Works!

Tournaments / Ted's Dread's 3rd annual Final Redbud Open, April 12th
« on: March 25, 2008, 11:31:55 AM »

Any discussion on this? 

Is Rick helping out with this tournament again this year?

Still scheduled as dated?

General Banter / New Courses around KC
« on: November 05, 2007, 08:40:29 PM »
I'm not from the area, but enjoy visiting.  The next time I make it up that way, I'd like to check out the new courses that have been installed in the last year or those who may be going in some time in the next year or so.

Could anyone give an update on the status of the whole list of them? 

Tournaments / OCTOBERFRIZ!
« on: September 22, 2006, 09:36:58 PM »
I'm surprised this thread is just now making it here.  This is for those of you who haven't yet made it down to Winfield to experience the Friz.  Those of you who have made the annual pilgrimage can attest to the following...

The biggest event in the midwest!  Hundreds upon hundreds come from all over the country.  This tournament is as much (actually more) about the good times than it is the golf.  In fact, the person who has the most fun will be given a Friz basket as will all the amateur division winners.
Quoting Friz-Rocker, the man who will be providing your entertainment...

The party starts Tuesday night,pick your partner and mixed doubles happen around noon wed the 11th and thu the 12th{all included in your entry fee}pick your partner moonlight doubles on,"FRIDAY THE 13th" about 9 pm.camping permits available,electricity,some hotels,but you might want to call ahead.The T.D,`s number is 1-620-221-1017,but don`t tell him I gave it to you.You can sign up anytime before tee-off sat about 10am.

All I would add to that is that it is at the Cowley Co. Fairgrounds on the south side of Hwy. 160, just on the west edge of Winfield, KS.  The singles takes place on Saturday and Sunday with all kinds of contests on the days prior.  Everyone camps at the course for free.  Free keg beer.  Just about everybody is going to be there, so don't miss it....

Blue Valley / Blue Valley Critique
« on: July 04, 2006, 04:05:30 PM »
I'd like to share my thoughts on this course after playing it yesterday, July 3rd.

One of the most incredible courses ever made, for sure. The tee pads and tee signs are especially impressive.

Before any hole-by-hole details... "Here's the official distances from the survey Bruce McQueen was so kind to do for us."

ft. ele.
1. 516 -19 Par 3
803 -13 par 4

2. 509 -66 Par 3

3. 369 +56 Par 3
696 +67 Par 4

4. 621 - 74 Par 4

5. 306 +29 Par 3
430 +27 Par 4

6. 319 +2 Par 3
534 +2 Par 4

7. 618 - 48 Par 4
744 -50 Par 4
938 -50 Par 5

8. 517 - 18 Par 3
624 - 12 Par 4

9. 395 +10 Par 3
746 +21 Par 5

10. 449 +34 Par 3

11. 539 - 75 Par 4

12. 499 +49 Par 4
533 +8 Par 4

13. 816 -59 Par 4

14. 406 +15 Par 4

15. 404 -11 Par 3

16. 440 +47 Par 4

17. 520 +2 Par 3
739 +22 Par 4

18. 569 0 Par 4
856 -4 Par 5

I had originally asked what these multiple distances meant. I now see that they are for different pin placements. Drastic differences in hole length for different pin placements (with different pars even) are not really along the same lines as most of the course design philosophy I've heard. Never-the-less, these seem very effective for this huge course, and the pars seem acurate.

I'm curious if more pins yet will be added as there is already plans for short tees. The holes certainly have room for more. I would agree though, that extra pins that are not close to as good as those existing wouldn't be worth throwing in just for the sake of filling up the course.

The current course, with the pin placements used in the Wide Open, plays par 68. I lost my Wide Open tournament course pamphlet, which showed hole distances and pars. The old scorecard,,
looks to be a little outdated in terms of hole pars. Just at a glance, hole 7 is a par 3 instead of 5, yet the entire course somehow adds up to 72, instead of 68.

Anyways, my impression was that the course was maxed out at 10,800 feet. As someone pointed out though, hole 7 is not on long. I also notice that hole 5 was on short, though I didn't notice the long pin. I'm pretty sure 8 was on long. Hole 12 was on the shorter, but tougher pin placement.

I'm just now looking above at the hole pars listed for the holes. They appear to match exactly what I read on the tee signs at the course. This suggests, however, that the course par when the length is maxed out , is 72. With 5 and 7 on short currently, the current course par would be 70. Where is the difference between calling the current course par 68 and 70? Any info here would help.

Also, is the current lenth 10,800 or is that the longest length? Is this course indeed the longest in the world, under a specific criterion?

I do notice the huge difference between pin placement pars for the entire course. While the "tips" play par 72, the shortest placements would yield a course par of 60. While the maxed setting is probably the best, as it boasts one of the world's most challenging layout's, it would be neat to see several regular layouts that could all have names corresponding with the course pars for the different layouts.

Putting in short tees will draw a lot more traffic to the course. Obviously, putting in more tees would be a lot of more work. The trickiest part would be coordinating them so that they work well for each of the pin placements the course has now, or will install in the future. My suggestion would be to make them standard size, rather than huge and elaborate in shape. Also, they wouldn't need tee signs of their own.

The only thing that I would say would have to be updated is the tee signs from the long pads. The short tees should be located on these signs (in red?). The signs are obviously great now, but if they are updatable, then they are even better. One thing I would make very clear is that the current tees are the PRO tees and the alternates would be AMATEUR tees. Hole pars and course pars would be for pros, from the pro tees. Making amatuer pars from amateur tees would be cool and all, but it would take a lot of organation (and perhaps tee signs for the am tees) to keep players from confusing hole pars and course pars and skill levels, etc. Some detailed stats on this kind of course would be very interesting though, especially hole scoring % stats for the Wide Open pro field.

Me and my friend played the course. He is very new to the sport. I am about a 945 ranked player. I shot 73 there, which I guess is close to par for my rating (I don't know, the round ratings are gone from the PDGA tourney results). I played very risky lines though, that resulted in several times OB. What I learned playing the course will be very helpful whenever I get the opportunity to play the course again. My friend was right with me scorewise, on the front nine, but had much trouble on the back. Though the course par is higher on the back, I believe the extra trees in play on the front make this the more difficult nine holes.

We played the course in about a 15 mph SW wind, which seems like pretty typical conditions for the course other than perhaps 90 degree heat.

Hole 1... Is a great starting hole with both a downhill and uphill drive required. A big arm could 3 it, but 5 is much more likely. The headwind, terrible rough to the left off the tee, and OB behind the green make this hole seem a bit towards a 4.5 pro scoring average.

Hole 2... Is very fun to drive. Going long is scary because of the road, but leaving your drive short can be just as bad. Second shot advice: lay up!!

Hole 3... Perhaps the most intimidating hole from the tee. The only hole with water in play. I don't like how two righty hyzer drives is the only way to play the hole. Taking out some trees to the left or maybe just some branches would offer much more to this hole. I did throw two perfect drives before duffing an uphill putt and making 5, while my buddy threw 3 safe, short shots and caned a huge uphill putt for a 4. I didn't notice the short pin. If it is off to the left, encouraging dual options from the tee, I'm sure it is good. Sculpting a shot through the trees up the hill is very difficult. I'm guessing the long pin averages 4.5 for pro players.

Hole 4... One of the best holes on the course. Dual fairways! I'm not sure how defined the one on the right is as I played the left. Only thing bad is how it is a bit of a crap-shoot, not being able to pick a visible fairway from the tee. Eagle 2 would be possible here. Awesome green! I wish we had more holes like this!

Hole 5... This hole didn't offer anything to the lefy. I new saw the long pin, but I assume it was up and to the right in the rough.

Hole 6... Very tough hole, with multiple options from the tee. Tough to penetrate the tree line and get on top. OB behind the hole makes the hole tougher yet. Didn't see the short tee, but if it is in a good spot, this could make a great hole as well. Too bad people dump their garbage in their own back yards on this hole!

Hole 7... I can't believe we played the short placement for this hole! I can't wait to see the long ones! Are they already in? If the wind was slightly more behind us (rather than from left to right), bigger bombs would have been possible.

Hole 8 ... Gotta play out over the road. Unlike my throw though, your disc should skip back in play with the prevailing tail wind.

Hole 9 ... I saw Alexi Bubis 3 this hole! I 4'd it, but not easily. A lot can go wrong on this hole with the headwind, uphill drive, and thick perimeter.

Hole 10 ... Should be a simple 3 it seems, but the unduation around the basket makes the upshot pretty critical. Great hole to measure your uphill drive against.

Hole 11 ... I threw into a tricky headwind / right to left wind. I went low and turned over late in the flight, just as I wanted. 30 foot from the pin on a 550' par 4. With my mulligan drive, I threw staight out and eventually hyzer over the big trees to land also within 30 of the basket.. The difference was that with my real shot, I had a very small window throught the trees to play my upshot, while the other drive was clear. I ended up hitting a tree right in front of me and making a good lay-up to save 4! While I thought this was stupid at first, a smarter drive landing short could have played a spike hyzer over the trees. I dunno though, I think at least a small window for the low left line is in order.

Hole 12 ... The shorter placement on this hole is actually much more difficult. 50 feet uphill, it is easy to underestimate. Wide open hole, I made a pretty easy birdie 3 though. Players playing heavy, overstable discs will not do well here. The other placement is actually an alternate for hole 13 as well? I don't think I like this. If it is in 13's fairway, it is not only in the way, but not the right direction to the next tee. And which one do you call the "long" placement?

Hole 13 ... Also a tricky cross wind hole, which may play as a straight head wind hole when the wind is coming straight from the south. The second shot is the critical one here as you can lay it up or you can overthrow OB.

Hole 14 ... I played the route over the road. The tee was pointing an opposite direction, but I saw this as the only chance to make use of the wind and get a chance at two. With the immediate uphill and a low ceiling tree, I caught just enough tree to send my drive OB. Maybe this hole is good to force the hyzer, but stubborn players like me have to learn the hard way.

Hole 15 ... This hole looks tougher than it should be. Just don't go weak or overstable on the drive and you should get a 2. The tee sign shows an alternate tee that appears to be even longer than the regular tee, but we didn't see it. What is going on here?

Hole 16 ... We looked to the right of this tee and got quite a sight. I huge towering pole with a tiered concrete square surrounding it. A drain at the bottom suggested it to be... a fountain! How tall is it? At least 100', maybe the biggest in KC? Why wasn't it on? The water may have hurt after falling so far, but the mist would have felt fabulous. With the terraced concrete, setting up a basket in this square would yield interesting results as a golf hole... Back to the golf hole. A roller is great here, but it needs to be big. Big arms shouldn't have much trouble birdying these mostly open holes on the back unless it's really windy.

Hole 17 ... Huge and uphill. Got to have a huge arm to get a 3 uphill and into the wind.

Hole 18 ... Very difficult finishing hole. The big anhyzer is probably tempting to many. The problem is that it puts the player too low in respect to the basket. Though more aggresive lines will yiled more distance, only the hyzer route is a good choice. I still can't believe how Josh Anthon won that hole at the end playing an anny and then a roller. Not a likely winning combination for this particular hole. Hyzer, hyzer, hyzer is how I (and most players) will birdie the final par 5.

My overall summary for the course is extreemly positive. The rolling elevation and wind make second shots very critical. Some have said that a big drive is not an advantage. I would disagree with this. It is true that a player cannot let his concentration slip with a second shot no matter how far his first shot goes. The course does indeed encourage smart play, and that is something that not many courses do well.

Righty / lefty balance is much in the favor of righty, I think. Righty has the advantage on holes 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, 8, 12, 14, 15, 17, and 18. The other 7 holes are fairly even or with slight advantage to lefty. I will say that the course is long enough so that the righty advantage is dampened a bit.

I can't say enough for the course's tee pads and tee signs. Huge contoured pads and signs that feature topography, elevation change and hole pars for each pin placement, plus the holes location on a map in relation to the rest of the course.... Something worth seeing for yourself! Who are the designers for this course? They deserve a lot of credit for this display of productive creativity. This course is a giant step for the evolution of course design.

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