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Messages - robm

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121
Tournaments / Re: Ratings Based Tournaments
« on: December 03, 2015, 11:55:51 am »
I'm still committed to be cheaper, which means smaller player packs, lower payouts, but will be tweaking items to make it sustainable.

Some tournaments don't have a Player Pack because that can be a risky outlay for a non-store promoter like me.  I have to order a minimum number of discs.  However, if I don't get the players signed up, then I'm left with a bunch of tournament stamped discs that nobody wants (I Like SpIke).  Pushing all entry to payouts makes sure I don't get stuck with inventory I can't sell.

With this being said, and I'm sure someone would point it out if I didn't, my first two tournaments next year will have a larger player pack because Innova is the presenting sponsor which is allowing me to provide more product.  If you haven't noticed, I like to mix things up a bit.  One of the tournaments next year will have the normal golf discs (TeeBird, Destroyer, Gator, etc.) for the Player Pack item, but will also include a second disc - a Zephyr, which is a SuperClass disc.  I actually looked into running a SuperClass event, but the PDGA stop sanctioning those a few years back.

Also - the Longview Open, will have a noticeable larger PP than what I can usually provide.  It will be an Innova exclusive disc (I don't even know what it is yet), a Performance Tee, baseball cap, mini, and other small items.

122
Tournaments / Re: Ratings Based Tournaments
« on: December 03, 2015, 11:48:00 am »
I have a better suggestion. No more payouts for Ams. Sorry not sorry, I know it isn't a popular opinion but we are one of the few if not only Am sporting events with a payout.

I would play a $10 PDGA Sanctioned tournament with no player pack, no payouts and trophy only every weekend of the year from March 1 to November 30th.  I think I'm like less than 1% though.

123
Tournaments / Re: Ratings Based Tournaments
« on: December 03, 2015, 11:46:30 am »
This thread wasn't intended to be about payouts, but I don't want to ignore some thoughts that were brought up.

Regarding payout depth - I actually do hear it from both sides.  I understand MK's views, and I understand BoltNutZ views.  Generally, I tend to run the tournaments the way that I would want to be if I played in them.  Deeper payouts make more people happy (although the top not as happy).  I get excited when I have a payout, even $10.  I'm like, 'cool dude, I CASHED!'  It does help people to play up versus playing down. 

I'll take myself, again, as an example.  I've been playing DG casually for 10 years, competitively for 5 years.  However, I have never broke a 851 rating and have only had 3-5 rounds ever above 900.  Not only could I play Rec, but most of my 'career' so far I could have played Novice.  Most of the time I play Rec, honestly, because it's cheaper and I'd rather play more tournaments.  Sometimes I play Intermediate because I get tired of explaining the rules to new players.  1-2x per year I'll play Adv. Master because the cost is the same and I'm not going to cash regardless of what division I'm in (Glass Blown Open, AM Worlds, etc.).

The costs of my tournaments are going to go up next year $2-3 per division.  Reality is I've lost more money in 2015 than made and am currently sitting in the red by a noticeable amount.  There isn't a business model, for profit or non-profit, than can do that long term other than our government (don't get me started).  I'm still committed to be cheaper, which means smaller player packs, lower payouts, but will be tweaking items to make it sustainable.

Some tournaments don't have a Player Pack because that can be a risky outlay for a non-store promoter like me.  I have to order a minimum number of discs.  However, if I don't get the players signed up, then I'm left with a bunch of tournament stamped discs that nobody wants (I Like SpIke).  Pushing all entry to payouts makes sure I don't get stuck with inventory I can't sell.

124
Tournaments / Re: Ratings Based Tournaments
« on: December 03, 2015, 11:27:54 am »
Here are my views:

As a 45 year old, I qualify for age protected divisions.  However, sometimes what I see in these protected divisions (including women divisions) are smaller numbers that could very well fit into other divisions such as Advanced, Intermediate or Rec.

For smaller tournaments, I think reducing the number of divisions allows more competition within divisions.  Ratings based tournaments can allow this to happen.  Reducing Divisions with Division based tournaments could also be done, but usually will illicit some questions if not complaints.

My first Ratings Based tournament was in Beatrice, NE earlier this spring.  I enjoyed it because I was competing directly with people within +/- 35 rating points of me.  I felt like the playing field was leveled and enjoyed that my ratings based group was more about skill level than age, gender, etc.

I think Ratings Based works well for smaller tournaments, i.e. less than 50, on normal length courses. I honestly expected Big Blue Monster to be less than 50 on a nice day.  I was very surprised that it was 73 on a cold windy day.  In hindsight, it would have been better to have the normal Division based divisions offered and if I do this next year (which I will if it doesn't have too much conflict with the KCFDC Championships), it will be a normal Division based tournament but may include Novice as well.

I am considering moving the Rose Park Open (formerly known as Tick Flick) in McLouth to a Ratings Based event.  The perceived number of players (40-70) would be better and the length of the course would not be particularly advantageous to a 900 rated 20 year old vs. a 900 rated 55 year old.  I think BBMonster was *potentially* easier for younger individuals with younger joints.

125
Tournaments / Re: Ratings Based Tournaments
« on: December 03, 2015, 11:15:30 am »
Got more feedback here than facebook, but I'll include those comments too.

Quote
One advantage of a rating-based tournament is that every player definitely has a place, particularly women. I've already lost count of the number of times I've seen a tournament that offers a broad spectrum of divisions for men to choose from, and women are lumped into fewer divisions, and some are not even offered. (As an example, the pro side of the GBO has many pro men's divisions, and ALL pro women are lumped into open.)

Quote
Division based are better. Ratings don't say much about how good of a player you are. Basic statistics will tell you that.

Quote
It's a fun change up, unique formats are welcome in my book!

126
Tournaments / Re: Ratings Based Tournaments
« on: December 02, 2015, 05:56:59 pm »
I intend to run both Division based and Ratings based tournaments in 2016.  I'm just getting everybody's views on it first.

127
Tournaments / Re: Ratings Based Tournaments
« on: December 02, 2015, 04:34:57 pm »
All in all was about the same, except there was no players pack I assume?

You are correct, there wasn't a player pack for this one.

There wasn't a direct correlation / causation between ratings based and no player pack.  There could be a player pack with a ratings based tournament, and I've played in and hosted division tournaments without a player pack.

My thought process behind making Big Blue a ratings based tournament and the thoughts of not having a player back were somewhat related, but they could be totally separated.

I'll provide my thought behind what I did in a while after more comments.

128
Heritage Park / Re: Some pics from our newest course.
« on: December 02, 2015, 04:30:34 pm »
love that last pic of the huge tree

129
Tournaments / Re: Ratings Based Tournaments
« on: December 02, 2015, 04:29:20 pm »
Thank you all for the comments.  I'll wait awhile longer before I write what I think about them.

130
Tournaments / Re: Ratings Based Tournaments
« on: December 02, 2015, 04:27:38 pm »
Rated round tourneys are nice but you should always be allowed to play up (some guys like donations)...Personally I have an 880 rating with the PDGA and have been playing 930+ golf here in KC. I would not play a rating based tourney layout knowing I could not play up because I would feel bad sand bagging.

Playing up was an option for the two I've been involved in.  You can't play down obviously.

131
Tournaments / Ratings Based Tournaments
« on: December 02, 2015, 01:17:40 pm »
What are your thoughts on Ratings Based Tournaments (vs. Division Based Tournaments).  Big Blue Monster was a ratings based tournie.

I have my opinions on them but I'm interested in hearing yours.

132
General Banter / Re: Practice Basket
« on: December 01, 2015, 08:51:15 pm »
Gateway makes one called a Bullseye.  Really easy to put up and take down.  No bolts.

133
Tournaments / Re: Maverick Disc Golf Schedule 2016
« on: December 01, 2015, 01:10:49 pm »
thanks.

134
Tournaments / Maverick Disc Golf Schedule 2016
« on: December 01, 2015, 12:29:03 pm »
BOLD items are the only one that have been fully approved.  Others have not been fully approved by the respective approval bodies including but not limited to the PDGA, State, County or City Parks Departments, and the KCFDC BOD if and when applicable.


Tournaments I'm planning on running or promoting or both.

https://www.facebook.com/MaverickDiscGolf/events

March 5 - Kanza Krush Presented by Innova Champion Discs  C/B Tier at Kanza Park, Ottawa, KS

April 9 & 10 - Longview Open Presented by Innova Champion Discs C/B Tier at Longview DGC, Ozawkie / Perry / Perry Lake, KS.  One day event with divisions split.

Saturday, 4/9/15 Divisions:
 Advanced
 Advanced Women
 Advanced Masters
 Advanced Grandmasters
 Advanced Sr. Grandmasters (if 3 or more request it)
 Recreational
 Recreational Women
 Junior 2 (16 & Under)

 Sunday, 4/10/15 Divisions:
 Open
 Open Women
 Master
 Grandmaster
 Intermediate
 Intermediate Women
 Novice
 Novice Women
 Junior 1 (19 & Under)

May 28 - Carolyn's Dirty Water Open (aka Tick Flick) C Tier at Rose Park, McLouth, KS. 
Ratings Based tournament instead of a Division Based tournament like the Big Blue Monster was.
Registration link:
http://dgscene.com/DirtyWaterOpen2016

June 18 - Atchison Aviatrix presented by Innova Champion Discs.  C/B Tier at Jackson Park, Atchison, KS.
Registration link:
http://dgscene.com/AtchisonAviatrix2016

August 20 - Limestone Classic C/B Tier at Swope Park, Cottone Wood Falls, KS
New course designed by Eric McCabe.
Registration link(opens June 19):
http://dgscene.com/LimestoneClassic2016


September 24 & 25 - Yankton (SD) 2-Step  2 separate tournaments in Yankton, SD.
Saturday at Gavins Point registration:
http://dgscene.com/Yankton2StepSaturday
Sunday at Fantle Memorial registration:
http://dgscene.com/Yankton2StepSunday



October 1 - Dotte to Dotte, C/B Tier at Wyandotte County Park, Kansas City, KS

November 5 - Big Blue Monster, C-Tier Ratings Based at Big Blue Valley, KCMO

November 26 - Centennial Chain Crash, C/B-Tier Centennial Park, Lawrence, KS

135
Hi rob.  Have you a list of tournaments and dates for your series yet. Just trying to get a list of all tournaments and dates written down on the calender.  I know it early still.

Will post shortly

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