Author Topic: Can I get a ruling?  (Read 2374 times)

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kchippie

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #15 on: July 19, 2010, 12:28:59 PM »
Rule 803.07B  If a disc at rest on the playing surface or supported by the target is moved, the disc shall be replaced as close as possible to its original location, as determined by a majority of the group or an official.

While the interpretation of this rule would seem straightforward, there are occurrences in the field that make the proper call challenging. First, once a player’s disc is at rest on the playing surface, the wind, a dog, another player’s thrown disc or anything else can’t move its position until that player arrives to mark their lie. For example, if the wind or a thrown disc causes a disc at rest to get up and roll down the hill or maybe it even lands OB, the disc is returned to its original position based on the group’s judgment. If that position is close to OB and was only seen by the group from a distance, the player should get the benefit of the doubt and be given an inbounds lie.

A disc at rest supported by the target might be “in” depending on where on the target it’s supported. If it’s sitting on the top of the chain support or leaning on the pole under the basket, it’s not in. However, if a disc in this position is struck by another player’s disc, that disc is returned to that position for the owner to mark and play from that lie to complete the hole.

If the disc is at rest in the chains or completely in the basket, the disc is just waiting for its owner to remove it to hole out. If it’s dislodged by the wind or another throw, the disc is returned to that position for the owner to remove it.

The most controversial part of this rule is when a disc is wedged in the side of the basket or hanging by a nub on the outside. Per this rule, once the group judges that the disc is at rest, it will be replaced there for the owner to complete holing out even if it subsequently falls off the nub or pops out of the side of the basket either by itself, wind or being struck by another disc before the owner gets there.

All discs but the yellow one will complete the hole once the owner gets to the basket and removes it before it possibly falls down and out.




At this point,  the rulebook does not define the amount of time a disc has to stop moving before the group should call it “at rest.” This decision is left to the group to make a reasonable judgment. So, whether a wedged disc will result in holing out or not depends on the group making the “at rest” call. (This judgment will hopefully occur faster than the amount of time it takes to sprint to the basket…)

Whoops! This wedgie popped out before the player got to it. Read what happens now.

wedgie

If the thrower of the “wedgie” has not yet gotten the “at rest” call from the group or they are not yet willing to do so, the thrower must quickly get to the basket and remove the wedgie to make sure it doesn’t pop out so the hole out can be completed. If it does pop out before it’s deemed at rest, then the new lie for the disc is where it lands on the ground and that thrower will then have to putt out.
Of all the things I've lost, I miss my brand new disc the most.

coops

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #16 on: July 19, 2010, 12:29:48 PM »
In the instance of the kid running in Milwaukee, it was apparent that the disc was not in the basket tight, and as such it was still moving.  The idea I would use is that of pool in that you can't hit another ball until all the other balls are at rest.....time limits are a group decision.....mayhem could ensue....

I think at that point even if he arrived at the basket and removed it before it fell out it should be penalized as interference. Once the disc is at rest it is at rest, and before it gets to that point any intentional interference should be penalized. I think largely this is a moot issue, the only way a disc could be at rest and come out of the bucket is if the wind is gusting strongly on any given day. If that is the case then it seems likely that at one point the disc could be at rest and then still fall out.

jack

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #17 on: July 19, 2010, 12:31:45 PM »
your understanding is wrong.  Once the card agrees that is where the disc is, then that is where it is placed.  Let say you are playing Waterworks.  You get to hole #15, you put it in the basket(wedged here for argument sake), everyone agrees, and it goes to the next person.  All of a sudden one of the neighbors dogs jumps the fence and goes for Gus to create new dogs....a fight happens around the pin.  In the midst of the fight, Gus thinking that he is helping his dad by saving the disc grabs it and takes off to hole #1.  Now the group decides where the disc was "at rest" before the chaos began, and its marked there as well.  Its the same situation with wedged discs.  If everyone agrees its in the basket, and another person throws and hits the disc and then both discs roll out of bounds, (lets use the same hole, as I've seen it happen...) the disc that was hit would go back into the basket, and the disc that hit the disc would remain OB.......so the best suggestion, go get it if its in the basket, you may get an ace, and help someone else from being mad by hitting your disc....
« Last Edit: July 19, 2010, 12:34:23 PM by jack »
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Tom

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #18 on: July 19, 2010, 12:35:08 PM »
Gus has no balls though.  ???

Timko

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #19 on: July 19, 2010, 01:08:44 PM »
So for the "group to agree,"  the entire group has to agree, not just half/majority?

Kevin Montgomery

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #20 on: July 19, 2010, 01:18:17 PM »
Gus has no balls though.  ???

I dunno, he seems pretty brave for his size to me.
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jack

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #21 on: July 19, 2010, 01:38:29 PM »
So for the "group to agree,"  the entire group has to agree, not just half/majority?

Majority for the group is alwasy acceptable, or the decision of a non playing official (could be another division on a different hole, but can't be your division.....
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"Disc Golf-
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Timko

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #22 on: July 19, 2010, 02:29:01 PM »
So for the "group to agree,"  the entire group has to agree, not just half/majority?

Majority for the group is alwasy acceptable, or the decision of a non playing official (could be another division on a different hole, but can't be your division.....

Cool.  That's useful to know.

dickthediscparker

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #23 on: July 19, 2010, 03:08:39 PM »
Every time I see this Subject pop up I think of this song...

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discglover

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #24 on: July 19, 2010, 11:38:20 PM »

I question why the disc hanging on the nub on the outside of the entrapment pointing to the ground is considered in?
Its not "inside the entrapment or chains "
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kchippie

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #25 on: July 19, 2010, 11:43:14 PM »
The disc hanging from the nub is still being supported by the basket, would be my best guess.
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discglover

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #26 on: July 19, 2010, 11:49:20 PM »
If we didn't count that one then we wouldn't be able to count the tacoed one.
How's that for answering my own question.
Neither have to be in more than halfway.
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Timko

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #27 on: July 20, 2010, 12:21:33 AM »
Hanging on the nubs is in.  The disc is supported by the basket.

Schoen-hopper

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #28 on: July 20, 2010, 08:24:39 AM »
Nubs on the bottom basket is good.  Nubs on the top of the basket is no good.

Timko

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Re: Can I get a ruling?
« Reply #29 on: July 20, 2010, 09:20:46 AM »
Sorry Jack, but that yellow one is out.