Author Topic: stirring the pot....  (Read 2776 times)

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jack

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #30 on: July 28, 2010, 09:52:28 AM »
I wasn't including that as a Des Moines League.....I do not think that they are the same format at all....
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discglover

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #31 on: July 28, 2010, 09:57:11 AM »
What do you think of this to make it interesting and appealing. No divisions on this one.
Everybody is an Open player.

http://kcfdc.org/forum/index.php?topic=5296.msg38651#msg38651
Steven Disc Glover

Timko

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #32 on: July 28, 2010, 10:00:49 AM »
I want to actually play golf.

discglover

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Steven Disc Glover

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kidmills

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #35 on: July 28, 2010, 01:56:32 PM »
Or we could just get rid of masters... allow those who are eligible to play in grandmasters and let the masters divide themselves b/t Open and Am as they see fit. They do that at some events too.
thats just plain stupid,just keep it as is

phisherman_77

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #36 on: July 28, 2010, 01:58:15 PM »
Why is that a stupid idea?  Come on, we've got some VERY good masters players in town that compete just fine in Open.


coops

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #37 on: July 28, 2010, 02:32:19 PM »
Or we could just get rid of masters... allow those who are eligible to play in grandmasters and let the masters divide themselves b/t Open and Am as they see fit. They do that at some events too.
thats just plain stupid,just keep it as is

Why is it that DG allows players to begin playing in age protected divisions like pro masters and adv masters at age 40 when ball golf, who've we've taken so many queues from in other areas, doesn't allow that until age 50? I'm all for the age protected divisions I just think they could be better split. I'd bet we'd create a need and desire for grandmasters with this kind of move and allow players who weren't there yet to decide b/t Am and Open. Some undoubtedly would move into Open and start vying for cash easily, and others would play Am and start doing very well in those divisions. On top of that, what could be better than the aged veteran whooping some young guy in a round and teaching them what real golf is about. I think a move like this would strengthen the competition in KC considerably.

Timko

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #38 on: July 28, 2010, 02:47:53 PM »
Now we're stirring the pot.

Here's another question to help:  What's the purpose of KCFDC leagues?

I always felt it was to put people of similar skill in compeitition against each other.  After calculating ratings for over 2000 rounds earlier this year, I will say that age is not the best grouper. 

Kevin Simpson

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #39 on: July 28, 2010, 02:58:47 PM »
I don't think the old guys like playing with us.

I always like it. I usually re-learn the lesson that the game is won and lost within 200 ft.

coops

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #40 on: July 28, 2010, 03:14:11 PM »
Now we're stirring the pot.

Here's another question to help:  What's the purpose of KCFDC leagues?

I always felt it was to put people of similar skill in compeitition against each other.  After calculating ratings for over 2000 rounds earlier this year, I will say that age is not the best grouper. 

And now for my first witness I'd like to call the expert Chris Timko. Chris, in your professional opinion, is the age group 40 and over accomplishing the goal of grouping players with similar skill levels together? Why or why not? And what would make a better split if indeed that split isn't the most conducive to good competition.

And now out of that mode...
Masters players out there... why do you choose to play masters? Is is purely camaraderie? Is it skillset? I think in order to understand the mindset of this division we're going to have to understand some of the purposes of the players who choose to play it. If it is mainly for camaraderie or something else like that then perhaps it isn't best to tinker, that is a goal outside of golf that our leagues are facilitating and probably shouldn't be tinkered with, but I don't think we'll know that till we hear from some more masters players.

Timko

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #41 on: July 28, 2010, 03:19:38 PM »
Let me first say that because KC is so blessed with the fact that it has so many leagues, I don't think we need everything to change.  The old way has worked for a long, long time.  I'd just like to see some expansion.  So perhaps 1 league a week could try:

Pro 1 / Pro 2 / Ams
Handicap / Scratch

The best way to really group people together is with ratings, but I'm not sure people want to do that.  The best would be to allow people to chose where they want to compete, but allow everyone to have the same options.

Kevin Simpson

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #42 on: July 28, 2010, 03:21:15 PM »
The problem is in picking whose league to mess with. Everyone is going to feel protective. I pick water works :-)

jack

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #43 on: July 28, 2010, 03:47:12 PM »
Masters used to be at age 35 within the last 10 years, and the revolt ensued with many people when they moved it 40.  Age sux.  You can't buy youth and elasticity in your arm and that is noticeable more so at 40 than at any other age in our sport.  Sure there are those that are fine specimens to prove otherwise, but the majority of the players in the 40-50 range are not as good at throwing longer and wear faster than they did a mere 2 years ago.

I play masters because it is age protected, and I am a youngster in the group, and i have a better chance of taking home some cash against players in the age bracket than I do in the Open field.  I like the fact that this year I got to play with many people that I have not been able to play with because they all played in the masters division.

Now I will play open from time to time if I am feeling spry....I dunno about moving it to 50 I think a revolt may occur.  I'd move back to open then though....
===o  {>[]----
Jack Lowe-
Parks Development Director for KCFDC
Multiple PDGA Worlds TD
Course Designs
913.485.5123-C
"Disc Golf-
Like ball golf, only faster,
cheaper, and healthier!"

Twister66

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Re: stirring the pot....
« Reply #44 on: July 28, 2010, 04:02:21 PM »
Something  for all of you young guns to consider and this is only my point of view and my thoughts.  I am 43 and a 910 rated player. To clarify I have never been good and due to my age some of my skills are eroding as fast as others are improving.   I am not good enough to play open and EVER cash.  I do cash-how ever infrequently- on  occasion in masters.  I choose not to play in the Am division for many reasons, if it does not apply to you than please don't be offend by my remarks, but they are absolutely true.

•   I usually have all of the plastic that I need.  I am not a beginner so I don't need to load up.
•   I play league not to make money, but to have fun.  By playing with masters age players I have a cohort that I can have fun with and usually  share some of the same sensibilities as myself about etiquette and  friendly competition.   
•   It is my own human frailty, or vanity, that I don't want to play with a 16 year old that picked up a disc for the first time last month and out drives me by 100'. Then talks about it the entire round.  It has happened more than once.
•   I also don't want to play in Am as the "party" division.  I am here to play golf not get senseless.
•   I know from asking that I am not the only masters age player that feels this way.  Remember all 300 active members aren't participants on the message board.

It is "league" play that has helped to make me an avid disc golfer.  I have played approximately 30 minis this year so I am not just someone talking about something that I don't have a vested interest in.  If the goal of KCFDC is to foster participation in disc golf in the Kansas City area how would we do that by excising  a group of people.  If the goal is to make as big a payout every night as possible for a limited number of people than I rest and lament the past like the geezer that I am.  A quick look shows that we average over a one hundred mini rounds in some weeks.  How many people are sitting at home saying if only I could potentially get paid $10 more I'm off the couch and out at league.

Forgive me for the length of this post.       

« Last Edit: July 28, 2010, 04:07:36 PM by Twister66 »
Jim Sherwood