Author Topic: 30th KCWO Think Tank  (Read 14937 times)

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HaterAde

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #105 on: December 10, 2011, 08:25:47 AM »
When I want your opinion, Palmer, I'll give it to you. That was a performance for the ages, and you WILL learn to show due reverence.

phisherman_77

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #106 on: December 10, 2011, 09:07:13 AM »
When I want your opinion, Palmer, I'll give it to you. That was a performance for the ages, and you WILL learn to show due reverence.

fine, fine.  just turn away from everyone when you discuss it.  you could poke someone's eye out.

jack

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #107 on: December 12, 2011, 11:03:57 AM »
When I want your opinion, Palmer, I'll give it to you. That was a performance for the ages, and you WILL learn to show due reverence.

fine, fine.  just turn away from everyone when you discuss it.  you could poke someone's eye out.

Now thas some funny stuff for me today, thank you both!

ON a side note, if anyone wants an "autographed" Greg Barsby Silverado with extended cab, there is one for sale for $1000.....

I'll see if I can find the You-Tube of it.....

PM me if interested in the truck.....
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Jack Lowe-
Parks Development Director for KCFDC
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Course Designs
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"Disc Golf-
Like ball golf, only faster,
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gleauzinier

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #108 on: December 12, 2011, 12:42:12 PM »
why not 30 separate events to commemorate the herculean effort to produce the first one? if you do have at least one of the events use the original smp island shot in honor of ace mcmason.
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Greenwood17921

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #109 on: December 21, 2011, 03:40:00 PM »
I think one reason turnout is lower is because of the market saturation.  There's too many events too close together and very few people can play every weekend.

The reason KC is notorious for weaker am payouts is becuase they are turning a profit off your entry fees.  Nothing wrong with that, it is what it is.  They charge retail for your player pack discs, where some TD's don't.  It's simple math...$8 disc, they charge you $15 out of your entry, there's a $7 profit per person per disc for DGW or the club or whoever...

So let's say you got 3 discs and for arguements sake let's use a nice round number, say a $5 markup.  That's $15/player times 50 players would be $750 that they profit, rather than payout.

Des Moines' philosophy is to cover the costs of the player pack - that is we spread it evenly amongst all players that receive one.  Instead of turning a profit, we return that in the form of payout to the players.  So the higher the am turnout, the better the payout will be (more to spread the cost amongst)

I'm not saying one way is better than the other, we all have different reasons for running tournaments.

I will mention though, that the problem our method creates, is burnout.  When you do something for nothing, it gets old pretty quickly.

NoSponsor

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #110 on: December 27, 2011, 10:11:55 AM »
Are you trying to advertise your tournaments on the KC Wide Open Post Greenwood? 
Sean Elliott

KCVinnie

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #111 on: January 02, 2012, 11:44:25 AM »
AM side - I would like to play a tough course the first round while I am well rested, like Cliff or Swope Gold.  I would like the second round to be sort of a moving day like Saturday on the PGA, give us some pins to shoot at, make some birdies and make up or lose ground quickly, Water Works is a great course for this because even set-up with easy pins it is a great course. Sunday, I would like Cliff or Swope Gold from the tips with 1 maybe 2 holes on the front and back 9 that are set-up for birdie chances.

For AM payout, I liked last years player pack, but I think it would be better to provide trophies deeper down the standings.  I liked Columbia where I finished in about the same place in the same division as the WO and was awarded with 6 discs as compared to nothing for the WO.  Maybe something like top 3 get a Star disc, 4 thru 6 get a Champ, 7 thru 9 a Pro, 10 thru 12 a Dx or something like that. 

Sunday Afternoon - I think most of the focus should be around how to make this as big a spectacle as can be made.  I was a little underwhelmed last year, which was more a function of my high expectations rather than how it was actually organized or run.  Not sure how to do it but getting everyone who participates in the event at the finals on Sunday as well as reasons for others outside of disc golf to come would be ideal.  The bigger the crowd the better for everyone.

Some of these ideas may have been tried before and failed, some may not be possible logistically, and some may just be poor, but it is the best I have.

1. Venue - I think Blue Valley is the best place we have.  Although if the courses up in Smithville were ready and we could have all divisions at one place, that would be awesome.
2. Have a central location at the park with the PDGA broadcast booth, disc vendors, food sales, a big scoreboard like the Masters, and some sort of a bleacher section.  I think if you have the Final 9 at Blue Valley there may be a spot by the parking lot to put a set of bleachers and sections for lawn chairs where people could sit and watch most of the Final 9 from 1 spot if the Final 9 were 1, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17.  I think it lends itself better to allowing newbies a chance to watch while not worrying about walking or making noise or moving and affecting the shots of the players.
3. Have a pamphlet that tells of the course and the major pro's at the event that people could purchase for a couple bucks, or possibly have an app for download that provides similar information.  If I bring friends that do not play, I would like to provide them information about the event and players.  Seems to me like the PDGA should be putting something like this out to help promote these type of events.  I'm not an app developer, but if the PDGA paid to have a template for the applications, that each TD could insert the information into, it may be cost effective for the app.
4. Have a food vendor out there selling hot dogs, hamburgers, etc.  I might be able to help with the vendor if one is needed.
5. Have a youth Drive, Approach, and Putt competition (similar to NFL Kick, Punt, and Pass) that ends before the final 9.  You could have this over on a hole on the short course at BV.  Get the event into the parks and recreation flyers for each major city in the area.  Not sure of the details, but maybe each child has to pay a nominal fee of $5 they get a disc and the winners get a dry fit shirt or something.  I really want to play in the WO, but if this is something the club wants to pursue and needs someone to run on Sunday afternoon, I might forgo my playing to make this happen.  I think having something like this on Sunday will help to bring people out to the finals.
6. I would like to see the Final 9 be a reset of the scores, so that everyone starts at even and plays for the championship with an equal shot.  I think for the fans, it will give the most excitement, but I understand it discounts the work on all of the previous holes.
7. Have the pro's tee off for their final round early Sunday at BV, same with the AM's at another park.  Have a final 9 for each division starting at 2:00ish from hole 1 at BV with the pro's being the last tee time. 
8. Provide a meal for each person in the WO, and the meal is provided Sunday afternoon at the Finals location.

These are the thoughts of a 30 something ex-college athlete who loves to compete, a father trying to raise kids and a little league coach who loves to teach and help out.
Vince
"Driving for show, putting for dough."

HaterAde

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #112 on: January 02, 2012, 12:42:44 PM »
Seems I heard a notion the other day about getting the pros' feedback when it comes to choosing courses for the WO. Would it be possible to print out surveys, mail them out to all the pros', and let them "vote" on which courses they play?

Has anyone ever tried this approach when setting up a tournament?

jack

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #113 on: January 05, 2012, 03:20:02 PM »
Wanted to share this in here....

As of right now I think that the ADV and Pro Fields are all set with regards to the BV, BS, Rosie, WW, Swope.

The"B" Tier could see the use of the K-7 Corridor courses, Olathe, Shawnee Mission, WyCo. 
The B-Tier will be all amateur divisions not on the Adv side and they will play 3 rounds, 2 saturday and 1 Sunday.

Initially we are looking at
(A)Open Men and Women doing:
Fri-BS-BV
Sat-Rosie-WW
Sun-Swope

(B)Age protected ADV and Pro Div:
Fri-BV-BS
Sat-Swope-Rosie
Sun-WW

(C) Adv Men & Women
Fri-Swope-WW
Sat-BS-BV
Sun-Rosie

Now this is up for discussion still, but should have it planned within the week as we may go the K-7 Route instead of this, but if we go this way everyone plays on the same courses....

(D) Int or Int/Rec
Sat-BV-Swope
Sun-BS

(E) REC/Novice
Sat-WW-BS
Sun-BV

The above though may be limited to 90 players and only one field, if that is the case you would only see a (D) pool configuration.

There will be camping available at Swope this year as well in Lake of the Woods, we hope to be able to have over 100 people staying there.  We have the camping area reserved from May 25-June 4th.  More information to follow, but that place shold be hopping the entire time!!
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Jack Lowe-
Parks Development Director for KCFDC
Multiple PDGA Worlds TD
Course Designs
913.485.5123-C
"Disc Golf-
Like ball golf, only faster,
cheaper, and healthier!"

Greenwood17921

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #114 on: January 16, 2012, 09:48:22 AM »
Are you trying to advertise your tournaments on the KC Wide Open Post Greenwood?

nope, just illustrating how two similar events in cost can result in a different balance in player packs/payouts for the amateurs that don't "get it". 

But if you're interested in the First Class Challenge, I'm sure Jack will be happy to give you a ride.  He'll be here along with everybody else to defend his enormous skins win, which he can also tell you all about.  Point being, I don't need to promote it on here.  People in KC already know.  BTW, I'm Park Hill class of '89 and the 'rents still live there, so technically I'm from there. :P

Greenwood17921

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #115 on: January 16, 2012, 10:09:08 AM »
Wow Jack that lineup is sick!  BS = blue springs, right?

no cliff? 

jack

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #116 on: January 16, 2012, 10:19:04 AM »
No Cliff at this time.  I am working on a few tweaks out there and more trees before we go all out on this course, and the Blue Springs/Blue Valley is sure to cause consternation in some of the top player's game!
===o  {>[]----
Jack Lowe-
Parks Development Director for KCFDC
Multiple PDGA Worlds TD
Course Designs
913.485.5123-C
"Disc Golf-
Like ball golf, only faster,
cheaper, and healthier!"

Greenwood17921

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #117 on: January 16, 2012, 02:49:33 PM »
love it.  Doing everything I can to make it this year.  See you the weekend before.

Is Swope going to be the gold layout, or just regular?
« Last Edit: January 16, 2012, 02:57:01 PM by Greenwood17921 »

Tom

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #118 on: January 16, 2012, 03:01:41 PM »
No Cliff at this time.  I am working on a few tweaks out there and more trees before we go all out on this course, and the Blue Springs/Blue Valley is sure to cause consternation in some of the top player's game!

More trees is good.

Is the KCMO parks & rec planting more trees?

jack

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Re: 30th KCWO Think Tank
« Reply #119 on: January 16, 2012, 03:12:03 PM »
KCMO P&R will be funding some of the trees, but Drew started the Tree Love Classic at Cliff Drive, so we have a matching funds program that I will be working with the P&R to create a long term vision of returning to the trees that were there that go down and haven't been replaced....

Swope will be Gold there Jay-Bird.
===o  {>[]----
Jack Lowe-
Parks Development Director for KCFDC
Multiple PDGA Worlds TD
Course Designs
913.485.5123-C
"Disc Golf-
Like ball golf, only faster,
cheaper, and healthier!"